Quote:

---

MarkW wrote: Art --
Since you have the quickest fingers out there, can you arrange the
Sonnets dedication into a 12 x 12 matrix and post it for us to
search for the cipher that pointed Barbara toward Neville?

---

I'd be happy to Mark
Code:

---

  ____  <= 12 =>
.
  TOTHEONL   _____ IEBE
  GETTEROF   _____ THES
  EINSVING   _____ SONN
  ETSMRWHA   ___   LLHA
  PPINESSE   _____ ANDT
  HATETER_ [N]____ ITIE
  PROMIS_ [E] __  DBYOV
  REVER_ [L] {I}__VINGP
  OETW  [I] {S} _HETHTH
  EWE  [L]-{L} _WISHING
  AD_ [V] {E} _NTVRERIN
  S__[E] {T} _TINGFORTH

---

If "NEVILLE" , itself, had been found
the probability would have been ~ 1/100,000

Having just "NELILVE" reduces
the probability by about 20 = ~ 1/5,000

("NELILVE" is one of only 20 simple permutations of
"NEVILLE" which involves a switch of just 2 letters.)

............................................................

Note, however, that "HENRY"
(or "O. HENRY") also exists
At a probability = ~ 1/500 :
Code:

---

 ____  <= 16 =>
.
  TOTHE __O.___  NLIEBEGETT
  EROFT_ [H]____ ESEINSVING
  SONN  [E]__   TSMRWHALLHA
  PPI_-[N]___  ESSEANDTHATE
  TE_ [R]_____NITIEPROMISED
  B  [Y]_____OVREVERLIVINGP
  O.E.____   TWISHETHTHEWEL
  LW_____    ISHINGADVENTVR
  ER_______  INSETTINGFORTH

---

So the combined probability is ~ 1 in a million.

Ergo:

HENRY NELILVE is almost as believeable a cipher as
HENRY WR-IOTH-ESLEY

or at least his namesake grandson seems to have thought so:
-------------------------------------------------------------
_The {ISLE} of Pines, or A late discovery of a FOURTH island
near Terra Australis incognita_(1668) by HENRY NEVILLE

Allen Banks & Charles Harper Londres

<<HENRY NEVILLE (1620-1694), the author of The ISLE of Pines,
was a member of a family with a long & influential record of
involvement with the political life of 17th century England... the tale,
written after the restoration of the Stuart monarchy, is a project
of the experience of defeat. The narrative begins with George Pine,
an imaginary traveler marooned with four women on an idyllic island
somewhere in the vicinity of Australia. With no apparent need to work
on this island, he sets about the task of populating & colonizing it.
After his death, his only son and heir tries to establish
an idyllic republic, but does not succeed.>>

Quote:

---

As far as I can tell, this:

Quote:

---

“Following the collapse of the rebellion, Neville was tried and sentenced to death, which was commuted to life imprisonment in the Tower..."

---

as BenW has said, is not true. The above is precisely what happened to Southampton, however.

Neville, on the other hand:

He returned to England in time to take some part in Essex's plot. Although he was not in intimate relations with Essex and his friends, he knew of their designs and was in the confidence of the Earl of Southampton. Consequently, when the rebellion failed, Neville was imprisoned in the Tower, brought before the Council on 8th July, dismissed from his place and fined £5,000. In the last year of Queen Elizabeth's reign, he agreed to pay that sum in yearly instalments of £1,000. On James I's accession, he was released (10th April 1603) by Royal warrant.


http://www.berkshirehistory.com/bios/hneville_1615.html

From the new DNB bio:

When Essex's armed rebellion failed on 8 February, Neville's reluctance to leave for France evaporated. Essex revealed the surprising news of Neville's involvement on 21 February and a warrant was issued for his arrest, which took place as he was taking ship at Dover. He was imprisoned in the Tower, brought before the council on 8 July, dismissed from his ambassadorship, and fined £5000. It was a heavy price to pay, given that his embassy had also cost him, according to his own estimate, £4000 in sales of his estates. During prolonged negotiations to secure his freedom he agreed to pay his fine in yearly instalments of £1000 and, on James I's accession, he was eventually released on 10 April 1603 by royal warrant.

--M. Greengrass

No trial or death sentence, just "prolonged negotiations" and a very large fine, it would appear--but perhaps James & Rubinstein have new information.

---

Hi KC,

Possibly Rubinstein and James need the death sentence to explain the despair which befell Neville in the Tower, leading him straightforward to writing Hamlet.
I rather think Neville's despair was caused by the fact that when he started writing Hamlet he became suddenly aware it was already written.

Robert

Quote:

---

Hi KC,

Possibly Rubinstein and James need the death sentence to explain the despair which befell Neville in the Tower, leading him straightforward to writing Hamlet.
I rather think Neville's despair was caused by the fact that when he started writing Hamlet he became suddenly aware it was already written.

Robert

---

Quote:

---

Having just "NELILVE" reduces
the probability by about 20 = ~ 1/5,000

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Having just "NELILVE" reduces
the probability by about 20 = ~ 1/5,000

---

Bob G.: What it reduces it to, Art, is certain coincidence. Why? Because no one would intentionally hide a name in a text without getting it right. As for your 1 in a 100,000 for a correct spelling, how did you arrive at that? 1 in a 100,000 that "Neville" will show up in this particular text using the particular matrix in this particular way? Or something less ridiculously meaningless?

---

    THE MOTTO OF SIR HENRY NEVILLE
 NE VILE VELIS (NOT VILE IS THY WILL)
------------------------------­------------------------------­-
________________   <= 15 => 
    
.
TOTH   [E].O.  NLIEBEGETTEROFTH___ *E*
SEIN_  [S]    VINGSONNETSMRWHAL _  *L*
HAPP-  [I]    NESSEANDTHATETERN___ *I*
TIEP__ [R]    OMISEDBYOVREVERLI__  *V*
INGP   *O.E.*  TWISHETHTHEWELLW-   *I*
SHING ____    ADVENTVRERINSETTI__  *N*
GFORTH
                            <= 23 =>

Quote:

---

Why would anyone trust the DNB? Joe

---